Alfie Lau (Burnaby Now) – The RCMP’s top cop in B.C. offered up his thoughts about the suspension of Burnaby RCMP Const. Susan Gastaldo, who faced dismissal after having a sexual relationship with her boss, Staff Sgt. Travis Pearson, in the spring of 2009.
Pearson had previously been suspended and had his pay docked for 10 days.
Last week, Gastaldo received a seven-day suspension, a reprimand and the three-member adjudication board also recommended that she continue to undergo counselling and that she be considered for a medical discharge.
Gastaldo worked for Pearson in the “Special O” surveillance unit in the Lower Mainland.
The RCMP adjudication board sat for five weeks and was comprised of three high-ranking officers, with two of them law school graduates.
Supt. John Reid was on the adjudication board and in his oral reasons for the judgment, ruled that Gastaldo and Pearson had a consensual affair, Gastaldo had lost credibility as a police officer and had levelled a false accusation against Pearson.
Asst. Comm. Craig Callens, commanding officer of the B.C. RCMP issued a statement on Feb. 23 on the Gastaldo case.
“I was not present to hear directly from the adjudication board today, but I believe it is necessary to provide a statement about the decision involving Const. Susan Gastaldo given the ongoing media interest in this case.
“The board sanctioned Const. Gastaldo to a forfeiture of seven days pay, a reprimand and recommended continued counseling. They also recommended that I consider a medical discharge for Const. Gastaldo as defined by the RCMP Act and Regulations.
“Const. Gastaldo has the option to appeal today’s decision within 14 days.
“My responsibility as commanding officer is to review the board’s written decision, and to consider what additional steps may be appropriate in this case.”
The board’s recommendations are not binding and Gastaldo’s lawyer, Larry McGonigal has indicated that Gastaldo will appeal the ruling to RCMP Comm. Bob Paulsen.
[Source]
Allow me to add my small voice to the community. Recently retired after more than 35 years. The RCMP was a great place to work overall. Some warts, of course, but what place doesnt? Overall, good people trying to do a good job. The young people are very motivated and try hard.
JG: “But, it doesn’t stop you from insinuating that most of the people on sick leave are abusing the system.
Never said that.”
Its people like the person on stress leave that got a law degree while on the public purse that irks me. Clear?
JG “Also, I guess your attitudes prove that the the RCMP isn’t a safe place to admit your mistakes, learn and grow from them”
Hogwash, I made my share of mistakes like anybody else, some doozies too. Learned and moved on.
JG “but if everything was peachy dandy in the outfit than we wouldn’t be having this discussion.”
Never said everything was peachy dandy. Just said its not a toxic workplace Canada wide that you day it is.
I stand corrected, you did not “do enough”, but “just didn’t formally do anything about it.”
JG “You like to talk about “the abusers”. But, the problem is how do you know they are abusing the system, other than the rumor and innuendo you heard around the water cooler?”
I heard directly from the person that got a law degree while on “stress leave”. Just for one example. The person off for 19 years was trained by a friend. Facts, need I go on?
People not cut out for the job? When you hear someone say: I did not sign up for this s**t, after having to scuffle with a man holding a knife to a kids throat.
So we will not agree in everything, however I would not trade my time in the outfit for anything. And contrary to your assertions, it is a rewarding place to work.
You think I am dismissing legit cases? Geezus johnnyg at least read and try to understand my notes before you launch into another tirade. I am talking about the abusers of the system! NOT, NOT, NOT the legitimate cases where members actually need help. Can I be any clearer??
I am sure there are legitimate cases of which you always talk about, you being part of the problem at one time and then after not standing up for another member getting it yourself. i get that. However, It is not a country wide toxic workplace you seen to rant about. I have not seen such activity where I have been and that is a lot more places than you.
Feel free to slag all the places you worked with and all the people you don’t think fit your workplace eden, but just because YOU think the whole country is toxic, it is NOT. You cannot speak for the places I have worked nor the dedicated people I have had the honor to work with. So just underline your slagging with what you know about first hand.
First off, there are abusers in every system. By the force sweeping the problems under the rug for so long and allowing itself to degrade to such a dysfunctional workplace only opens the door for these kinds of complaints.
Secondly, yes that is great you have had nothing but good experiences LindaPepper, but if everything was peachy dandy in the outfit than we wouldn’t be having this discussion. Also, you can no more speak for the bad experiences these people out of sick leave had, than how I can talk of your good experiences. But, it doesn’t stop you from insinuating that most of the people on sick leave are abusing the system. Just because I believe that people should have a harassment free workplace doesn’t mean I am advocating the workplace turn into some kind of “Eden” or country club. You have taken my message and deliberately taken it out of context. When you speak in such sarcastic overtones it discredits the little disclaimers you interject such as “I am talking about the abusers of the system”.
Also, I guess your attitudes prove that the the RCMP isn’t a safe place to admit your mistakes, learn and grow from them. Guess, this is what happens when you break the silence. But, someone at some point has to be the bigger person and admit they were wrong to see changes made.
Lets be clear about this, I never said that I did “nothing”, I just didn’t do enough. I was mostly a passive part of a problem just going about my business and doing my work, but the problem was so engrained and so many supervisors were in on it, I also felt it wouldn’t do any good anyway and would just bring harm to myself aIso. It is dangerous to be right, when any given organization is wrong. What I haven’t talked about was how I tried in vain to quell some of the displaced anger against the person, I just didn’t formally do anything about it which was a mistake i learned from and if I have to get mud thrown at me from monday morning quarterbacks and endure these kinds of low blow’s to inform others and get my message out, than so be it.
But, to be honest with myself (I am sure you will use this against me at your convenience) , I used a lot of the attitudes you have listed to justify not doing enough. I felt the person didn’t belong in the outfit, isn’t cut out to do the job, didn’t work hard, was looking for a free ride.ect But, when the mob went after more capable people, including myself than I realized that this was the worst type of dysfunction and was a far cry from the “peer pressure” that was used to motivate people. If that were the case than the attackers should have been attacking themselves, because there were a band of jealous lazy troublemaking self serving slugs.
You like to talk about “the abusers”. But, the problem is how do you know they are abusing the system, other than the rumor and innuendo you heard around the water cooler? My point is, and it wasn’t specific to you is that in the outfit all too often deliberately mislabels the true problem and victim blames.
I also think it is possible to tell the abusers from the legitimate hostile work environment complainants. But, I don’t believe the outfit has the proper outlook or people in place to accomplish this. Investigating hostile work environments is not the same as most other investigations. When harassment targets start complaining they are often discredited as “paranoid”, but most supervisors don’t have the expertise to tell the difference between a paranoid person vs a hyper vigilant person. This is one example of little clues that an expert in the field who is educated in it can examine and make up a piece of the puzzle that a high school educated supervisor isn’t able to do…. There is no substitute for good common sense, but sometimes more than that is needed. As crazy as this sounds, it is known withing the field of mobbing and workplace bullying that most regular psychologists don’t’ even understand workplace bullying and mobbing and too often misdiagnose such behaviors as “parinoia” and a sympton of a pre existing condition because they can’t believe what they are hearing.
So I also think you should underline your slagging of “abusers” to what you know first hand as well….
don’t give me another motherhood statement.
Nice motherhood line there
One question to ask yourself is what did we do before we allowed people to go off duty mad?
lindapepper quote
The only thing that I can say regarding this topic is; that the diameter of our knowledge dictates the circumference of our activity in dealing with sick leave due to stress and medical discharges in the RCMP. Unbelievable!
Calvin Lawrence
LindaPepper, in a Swedish study that compared the stress of train drivers who ran over suicidal persons (who threw themselves under the track), have far less traumatic stress than those who had suffered from a hostile work environment. It wasn’t even close.
Bringing up the horrific things you see are is joke and nothing compared to the physical, emotional and psychological devastation someone who has undergone a hostile work environment. I know because I have had my hands on plenty of dead and dying people. I have also been “Pearl Harbored” and stabbed by someone crazed on drugs who was trying to slash my neck open with a knife. None of this ever fazed me or caused me any long term acute stress. But you know what keeps me up at night? I’ll give you a hint. It’s not the guy with the knife or the image of the dead guy with his eyeballs popping out during CPR on the side of the road…
Dismissing the complaints of people are on sick leave as “those who can’t cut it” is how the force and it’s sheep/trained seals have been discrediting those with legitimate complaints since the beginning of time. Not to mention how it feeds into a superiority complex. But at the end of the day, the kind of dysfunctional, sick organization the force has become flourishes when you take away the voice of the persecuted.
Also, I just want to point out that a lot of these people are probably not too sick to work. They are just too sick to work for the RCMP.
The honest people who have been legitimately driven from their jobs suffering from PTSD are being told “here is the medicine, but go back to the toxic workplace and keep drinking the poison”. As long as the RCMP remains a sick, toxic and dysfunctional workplace were complainants are routinely discredited and the management sweeps the harassment problem under the rug, than no sick person in their right mind would want to return to that. If anyone is that out of touch with reality, than I wouldn’t want them to return to work….
Well Calvin, as you should know most occupations have medical rules and regulations. If after a specified period of time, say 2 years for a lot of jobs, you are not able to come back to work you go onto long term disability paid by insurance companies. Your appeal to stick around is given to a medical review panel of experts in the field of your disability. They determine if you will be able to come back to your job or not. This should not be news to you.
We do not have the defined policy in place to do this. All you can do is ask for a review of a members status through health services and they go by what the attending doctors say. If the docs say its over for the member then they can get on with a medical. But there is no time limit to the process. If for other occupations 2 years is a standard then I’m all for 2 years.
And as for the 7 years, yes I base that particular decision on that particular figure. Come on 7 years? Or how about 19 years? Where is your line Calvin, and don’t give me another motherhood statement.
You ask what I would do? Lets see, if I was the King, you could be off with your doctor(s) agreement for 2 years. After that time, you are off the public purse onto the insurance companies books on long term disability. Your appeal to an independent medical panel of experts in your disability would be convened. If they determine you cannot return, medical pension. If they determine you will return in 6 months, then in six months you are back. If not, medical pension. No revolving door with coming back and leaving and coming back and leaving such as we have seen ad naseum in the past number of years.
You said: Crude classifications and false generalizations are the curse of organized life.
Nice motherhood line there, are you looking for chapter and verse on medical policy or just throwing it out there?
And KP, while we have those descriptions, we also have, satisfaction, camaraderie, service, dedication, respect, loyalty, tradition, and history. Not all descriptors fit everyplace or every individual. Too bad you have not had the same return on your investment as I have. But you cannot get away from the fact that some people were obviously not cut out to be cops. Its not everybody that can see sexually abused children every case, fatal victims, suicides, domestic violence, personal tragedy, on a regular basis.
One question to ask yourself is what did we do before we allowed people to go off duty mad? “I don’t like this new shift” so I’m ODM. Real fair to your co-workers. Maybe you are not old enough to know.
Dr. Linda Duxbury conducted an independent report which spoke of work place health within the RCMP and reported in part, the following:
RCMP culture is not one that supports change. Nor is it one that promotes workplace health or provides competitive advantage.
Words that describe the general culture include: paramilitary; hierarchical; Pollyannaish, respectful of the position rather than the person; overcommitted; one that declares victory before achievement; over stretched; one that shoots the messenger; risk adverse; defensive; low trust; one of winners and losers; one that gives preference to dealing with issues rather than people; one that under values HR; cash managed; non aligned; siloed; focused on process and face time not common sense and output; change fatigued; exploitive; policy versus practice, hours and presenteeism versus output, playing the game; complex (culture changes with level and COE).
Unfortunately management chooses to ignore the findings thus making the organization sick. What if any of the aforementioned findings promote a work healthy environment? Are we really that stunned or surprised memers are ODS for extended periods of time?
Maybe it’s time to put the Kool Aid away Linda Pepper.
Its meant for the abusers of the system.
Lindapepper
I understand that you differentiate between RCMP members who righteously use the medical discharge system, sick leave, and those who abuse it.
After 7 years there is very likely no return.to stressful police work
Lindapepper
Am I to understand that you base your decision on the time the person is on sick leave to decide if they are playing the system or not?
If so, what would be the time line that the sick leave appears justified to where it becomes abuse? Two Weeks? Six months? one year?
What would be the process that you would use to determine the legitimacy of the sick leave and medical discharge other than time lines?
Crude classifications and false generalizations are the curse of organized life.
Calvin Lawrence
Calvin Lawrence
Hey Calvin, don’t put spin in my note that isn’t there. Its meant for the abusers of the system. After 7 years there is very likely no return to stressful police work, so just get on with the inevitable and quit sucking down the public tax dollars that could be used to fill out our front lines with actual working members.
You haven’t been around for quite a while and I can tell you as I write this there are members beating up the system. You can do all the investigation you want but when the doctors say he/she cant come to work because they are afraid of the dark, to depressed, uniforms scare them, they have become agoraphobic, and all the other excuses, the doctors sign them off lest they pull a postal and they (the doctors) be sued. Or they come back for a week and away they go again.
You really think someone off for so many years will be fit for police work? Never seen it happen in my time which is quite a while. The RCMP unlimited sick time which helped many members over the years, especially with physical issues has become sadly abused by a few. Which of course will lead to it being drastically modified affecting the deserving members.
So hand out the medical as far as I am concerned. Don’t feel sorry as they come with generous pension guarantees (75%) and the medical coverage.
And just how do you “force” someone to stay on sick leave? When the doctor signs you fit for full duty, at the very least GRW kicks in. Just ask legal branch, which I did.
You said: Please remember if RCMP management wants to have a member out of the force they will stop at nothing to accomplish this. Really? So how come it took 19 years to get rid of the one LMD member (I wont say woman lest you think I am sexist)?? Malarkey.
How many medical discharges were handed out.
medical out the woman.
Should be handing out more medicals
lindapepper
—————————————–
It is unfortunate and sad the callous and uncaring approach that appears you have for legitimate members who are on sick leave due to stress.
Yes, there are Individual RCMP members who will take advantage of sick leave. An organization that is functioning properly will do a timely and accurate investigation. Simply determine who is abusing the sick leave process and who is not.
Please remember if RCMP management wants to have a member out of the force they will stop at nothing to accomplish this. That includes forcing them to stay on sick leave as long as possible with bureaucratic abuse. That is especially true if the member has launched a civil or human rights complaint.
Please remember you are not dealing with cans on a shelf that are being “handed out” (as your terminology indicates) .
These are people who, in some cases are in emotional pain, isolated, disillusioned, and fighting work place psychopaths.
Calvin Lawrence
The report for 2009 said that 336 employees in B.C. were on long-term “Off Duty Sick,” with some having been on leave for up to 7 years. The number has since changed to 231, in 2010. Out of 6,500+ members in the province. How many medical discharges were handed out. I would like to know that.
It took 19 years to medical out the woman from the LMD 2 years ago. Hardly an abuse there, except to the taxpayers who paid out her salary over that period. Should be handing out more medicals.
I agree 100% that the medical and psychological discharges are being abused. This is how the game works, bully and make someones life hell, sit back and watch them have their mental and physical health fail than push for the discharge. This game on how to get rid of someone is found in every corner of the outfit, from depot on up.
A forensic psychologist who does independent evaluations for a municipal department told me that RCMP psychologists are a shill for management….
If any media savy reporter was to to look for a juicy story into corruption, bullying and abuse of RCMP members they should do a documentary on “E” Division Health Services and their abuse of members with this medical discharge BS. Another form of bullying, mobbing and treating serving members like crap. They serve the management masters and are incapable of discharging their duties under the oaths of their various colleges of professional standards. I wouldn’t let them examine my goldfish.
The board sanctioned Const. Gastaldo to a forfeiture of seven days pay, a reprimand and recommended continued counseling. They also recommended that I consider a medical discharge for Const. Gastaldo as defined by the RCMP Act and Regulations.
Article Quote
What I find disturbing is the statements regarding a medical discharge.
This is a medical issue and the board and the CO are not in a position to recommend a medical discharge or comment on treatment.
The penalty of the board is separate from the medical treatment. If a member retires, or leaves the RCMP on a medical discharge; it should be kept private unless the members wishes to divulge that information. RCMP members who are on sick leave are assessed by medical experts and as long as there is a reasonable expectation that the member can return to work a medical discharge is not an option.
Accusations of abuse of the medical discharge process is not unheard of in the RCMP.
Calvin Lawrence